Author Topic: A look back at the pink jacket animators  (Read 10703 times)

FilmmakerJ

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Re: A look back at the pink jacket animators
« Reply #30 on: April 26, 2012, 07:49:15 pm »
I don't get what makes Nostradamus so much worse than some of the other specials and movies from the last 20 years.

It isn't. For the most part, those specials/movies/OVAs range somewhere from bad to bland. There's very few actual bright spots.

Out of the 32 total movies to this day, and out of the ones I've actually seen, these are the ones I deem either fun/enjoyable/well-written/exciting/or memorable in some other way, making them worth watching:

1. Castle of Cagliostro
2. Secret of Mamo
3. Crisis in Tokyo
4. Plot of the Fuma Clan
5. Pursuit of Harimao's Treasure
6. Legend of the Gold of Babylon
7. Strange Psychokinetic Strategy
8. Dragon of Doom
9. Bye Bye Liberty Crisis

The rest that I have seen don't nearly have enough things to make them stand out and go into this list. Sure "Dead or Alive" has some elements that I like, and so do "Nostradamus" and "Missed by a Dollar." But most of those other films are dark, dramatic, and at many points, dull. I have yet to see any of the specials post "Alcatraz Connection" except for "Episode 0" and "Lupin vs Conan." So if I ever do get to see any of those, I will likely include. 2 or 3 of them on this notable list as well.

The bad guy in Nostradamus sucks, it's got a smart-assed kid character who drags the story, Goemon and Jigen are barely in it, and it's a pretty slow special to actually get through.

Small gripe, but, wasn't "Nostradamus" a theatrical feature, not a TV special?

Psycho_Kenshin

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Re: A look back at the pink jacket animators
« Reply #31 on: April 26, 2012, 08:16:42 pm »
I love lots of the specials (and movies) myself. I'd say they range from bad to really really good, and there are only a couple I'd call flat-out bad. From 1997 to now, that particular range I've found very strong with them all ranging from okay to great. I've reviewed a bunch of them and 8/10 is pretty much the most common rating for me with these, really good.




RedTail

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Re: A look back at the pink jacket animators
« Reply #32 on: April 26, 2012, 08:37:19 pm »
I think one the best ways to evaluate anime, including Lupin, is to ask yourself what you would recommend showing to someone who has never watched anime before. In other words, someone who has no attachment to this stuff like you or I do. If you think it'll go over well with them, it's probably a decent title. It's not reliable in all cases (like shows that require you to have seen other ones before it), but it's still a pretty good benchmark. Certainly better than the "it's all Lupin so it's all good" philosophy I often see around here.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2012, 08:40:06 pm by RedTail »

Psycho_Kenshin

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Re: A look back at the pink jacket animators
« Reply #33 on: April 26, 2012, 08:42:57 pm »
I've shown specials to people who'd never seen Lupin before, and indeed some people have enjoyed them. Not that I agree that's the #1 rubric to go by when reviewing something in a long series.

FilmmakerJ

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Re: A look back at the pink jacket animators
« Reply #34 on: April 26, 2012, 09:30:59 pm »
I think one the best ways to evaluate anime, including Lupin, is to ask yourself what you would recommend showing to someone who has never watched anime before. In other words, someone who has no attachment to this stuff like you or I do. If you think it'll go over well with them, it's probably a decent title. It's not reliable in all cases (like shows that require you to have seen other ones before it), but it's still a pretty good benchmark. Certainly better than the "it's all Lupin so it's all good" philosophy I often see around here.

If I was every going to show Lupin the 3rd to anyone who's never seen it. I'd probably show them "Crisis in Tokyo" and or "The Pursuit of Harimao's Treasure," that way they get a good idea of what the regular Lupin is supposed to be like. After that I'd show them Cagliostro so that they understand that it is one of the black sheep of the bunch and not the main style. Although, I'd probably actually show some choice episodes from the Red Jacket series first, then those red jacket movies, and then Cagliostro.

After that, if they're still interested, I'd show them "The Secret of Mamo" to really blow their minds, and then what ever else.

Although, I do have a friend I've been trying to get to come over and watch a Lupin movie with me because he became a bit interested after I talked about Yuji Ohno in one of my Toastmaster Speeches. And I've decided to show him "Mamo" because it's pretty darn crazy, and I think he'd get a kick out of it. I still think Mamo has some of the most interesting music from all of Lupin and Yuji Ohno's career.

RedTail

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Re: A look back at the pink jacket animators
« Reply #35 on: April 26, 2012, 10:21:13 pm »
I think one the best ways to evaluate anime, including Lupin, is to ask yourself what you would recommend showing to someone who has never watched anime before. In other words, someone who has no attachment to this stuff like you or I do. If you think it'll go over well with them, it's probably a decent title. It's not reliable in all cases (like shows that require you to have seen other ones before it), but it's still a pretty good benchmark. Certainly better than the "it's all Lupin so it's all good" philosophy I often see around here.

If I was every going to show Lupin the 3rd to anyone who's never seen it. I'd probably show them "Crisis in Tokyo" and or "The Pursuit of Harimao's Treasure," that way they get a good idea of what the regular Lupin is supposed to be like. After that I'd show them Cagliostro so that they understand that it is one of the black sheep of the bunch and not the main style. Although, I'd probably actually show some choice episodes from the Red Jacket series first, then those red jacket movies, and then Cagliostro.

After that, if they're still interested, I'd show them "The Secret of Mamo" to really blow their minds, and then what ever else.

Although, I do have a friend I've been trying to get to come over and watch a Lupin movie with me because he became a bit interested after I talked about Yuji Ohno in one of my Toastmaster Speeches. And I've decided to show him "Mamo" because it's pretty darn crazy, and I think he'd get a kick out of it. I still think Mamo has some of the most interesting music from all of Lupin and Yuji Ohno's career.

I'd personally start with Albatross Wings of Death. It's short, action-packed, entertaining, and looks great. More importantly, it's not overly zany like some of Miyazaki's later first series episodes, and Lupin doesn't totally come across as being the same sentimental nice guy that he is in Cagliostro. It also has a pretty good dub.

busterbeam

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Re: A look back at the pink jacket animators
« Reply #36 on: April 29, 2012, 07:39:36 am »
I'm not really going to defend the story of a movie that is outright poorly written at all, I just don't really like it when people do stuff like saying "this movie has horrible cheap animation" when actually they mean "I don't like the style of the character designs". It's kind of natural that after so many stories, there was a drought of content throughout the green jacket era that led to formulaic or dumb ideas that didn't hold a candle to, say, the best episodes of green & red jacket, and certainly the character design inconsistency was odd. But ultimately it had some really expressive and super-dynamic drawings and movement in it regardless, not to mention genuinely varied posing and expressions and all sorts of stuff which are all hallmarks of good comedy cartoons.

I don't even think many people honestly think Yuzo Aoki's Lupin (S3 and Babylon) has "legendarily horrible animation"; it's likely a rushed way of saying "the style isn't my cup of tea". I'm also willing to bet that fans of Monkey Punch's manga are more likely to enjoy it, much like Monkey Punch no Sekai: Alice (another Yuzo Aoki adaptation of a Monkey Punch work) which was actually a pretty competently put together comedy OVA but got a massively negative reaction from people who just didn't expect its "unadulterated Monkey Punch" sense of humor to be as mean-spirited and immature as it was. It's known as a horrible OVA because people unfamiliar with that style of humor didn't know what to expect when they watched it, but funnily enough I got like three people to watch it and all of them thought it was good. Then I got someone who hated it to change his mind about it.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2012, 07:49:27 am by busterbeam »

fantasticmrfox

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Re: A look back at the pink jacket animators
« Reply #37 on: May 02, 2012, 01:26:53 pm »
I don't get what makes Nostradamus so much worse than some of the other specials and movies from the last 20 years.

It isn't. For the most part, those specials/movies/OVAs range somewhere from bad to bland. There's very few actual bright spots.

Out of the 32 total movies to this day, and out of the ones I've actually seen, these are the ones I deem either fun/enjoyable/well-written/exciting/or memorable in some other way, making them worth watching:

1. Castle of Cagliostro
2. Secret of Mamo
3. Crisis in Tokyo
4. Plot of the Fuma Clan
5. Pursuit of Harimao's Treasure
6. Legend of the Gold of Babylon
7. Strange Psychokinetic Strategy
8. Dragon of Doom
9. Bye Bye Liberty Crisis

The rest that I have seen don't nearly have enough things to make them stand out and go into this list. Sure "Dead or Alive" has some elements that I like, and so do "Nostradamus" and "Missed by a Dollar." But most of those other films are dark, dramatic, and at many points, dull. I have yet to see any of the specials post "Alcatraz Connection" except for "Episode 0" and "Lupin vs Conan." So if I ever do get to see any of those, I will likely include. 2 or 3 of them on this notable list as well.

The bad guy in Nostradamus sucks, it's got a smart-assed kid character who drags the story, Goemon and Jigen are barely in it, and it's a pretty slow special to actually get through.

Small gripe, but, wasn't "Nostradamus" a theatrical feature, not a TV special?

you should give Island of The Assassins a try. it's a really good one.